Art of Manliness - Latest Comments in Men of Legend: The Battle of the Alamo

Re: Men of Legend: The Battle of the Alamo

Logan Millsap — Wed, 02 Apr 2014 18:20:54 -0000

My relative, Isaac Millsaps, was a member of the Gonzales Ranging Company of Mounted Volunteers, which actually did respond to Travis's call for reinforcements. As they rode up to the fort in the wee hours of March 1st the Texians thought they were a band of Mexicans and fired on them, wounding one.

Isaac Millsaps riding to the defense of his doomed fellow Texians is, to me and my family, a fine example of true manliness.

Re: Men of Legend: The Battle of the Alamo

Ben G — Thu, 19 Sep 2013 19:21:35 -0000

Battle of the Alamo to keep Texas a slave state?! I taught 7th and 8th grade history for a while, and you, sir, must have quit school before then.

First off, Texas wasn't even a state yet.

Second, they were fighting to be free from Mexican rule.

@Jacob Acosta

You may have some information from someone who wrote a book about Crockett, but it does strike me as strange that in my research and that of others here we have never come across that information. The Crockett that I have looked up was a much more admirable man than the one you describe.

Re: Men of Legend: The Battle of the Alamo

Carl Fowler — Sun, 23 Jun 2013 23:01:14 -0000

You bleeding heart liberals make me sick...always looking for a way to bad mouth this country...let me take you back in history to " The Massacre at Goliad " which took place after th battle at the Alamo...your great and wonderful Santa Anna ordered the massacre of 330 prisoners of war at Goliad...carried out on Palm Sunday March 27, 1836 no less...so much for the Catholic religous mexico...the bodies were stripped and piled in heaps, an attempt to burn them failed so they were left to rot and be scavenged by dogs and wild animals!

As for me God bless the USA and remember the Alamo!!!!

Re: Men of Legend: The Battle of the Alamo

Bill Barnes — Thu, 07 Mar 2013 09:52:52 -0000

I've never understood why the men stayed in the Alamo to fight and face a sure death! I understood in my grade school History that at least some of them could have escaped through the Mexican Lines at night and might have lived to fight another day! As The Birdman Of Alcatraz said, "Life is too precious to be thrown away"!

Re: Men of Legend: The Battle of the Alamo

Uziel — Sat, 18 Apr 2009 11:36:32 -0000

Why is everyone voting down the comments on the slavery issue? I love the article, which is at it's core about willing to die for what you believe in, and in this case those men believed in the independence of Texas and their rights. Nothing more manly than that. However, this isn't cause to ignore basic facts. At the time, Texas was a part of Mexico. Mexico had abolished slavery. Texas fought for independence, got it, legalized slavery and was annexed into the United States where it was already legal. The people living in San Antonio were already US citizens doing what they perceived as their legal right under their countries' laws. Stating these facts does NOT detract for their brave actions to defend their rights, even if the course of history could possibly later vilify some of their motives. It doesn't, so that is irrelevant.

Re: Men of Legend: The Battle of the Alamo

Jacob Acosta — Fri, 10 Apr 2009 16:29:49 -0000

This is crap.

Yeah flag me down whatever, but this comes from a collegiate historian in San Antonio.

Let's take Davy Crockett for example, his biographer, Marl Derr, wrote in 1994 that he was a "drunk, brawler, womanizer, adulterer, upstart, liar, loser, and hypocrite."

Is this really someone to hold in such a high esteem?

Good way to promote false nationlistic ideas based on racial biases, Chris. Yes some American's came-Stephen Austin- to the Mexican frontier and attempted assimilation. Others, however, were born under a flag with the predisposition of unprecedented growth, who would ultimately murder thousands in order to accomplish those pursuits.

If you want to give a history lesson, than I would recommend you not focus on revolutionaries because its always the victor's story that typically gets told despite the fallacies, as apparent by your post.

Re: Men of Legend: The Battle of the Alamo

Roberto Baca — Wed, 08 Apr 2009 21:03:21 -0000

Texas will always be an open wound for Mexicans. Not only because of itself but also as the first chapter of the invasion that would follow ten years later and that would end up with the loss of half our territory. There is no need to excuse or apologize for the Texian motives, though, or to doubt their honor or their word.

Although there were a good number of squatters, most had swore allegiance to Mexico, became Catholic and were overall good Mexican citizens. A special dispensation was made for slave ownership, since a lot of them wouldn't have made the trip without slaves. A very important fact to keep in mind is that they had sworn allegiance to the Constitution of 1824 which made Mexico a federal republic.

Several factors contributed to the Texian revolution. One was the end of the dispensation for slavery and the institution of customs between the US and Texas border (before then the Texians were able to import goods from the US duty-free); but this wasn't that important. Another was the interest of the US government to expand towards the Pacific and had sent a number of agitators to incite the population. But they had been largely unsuccessful, greatly thanks to Steve Austin who honestly believed that the future of Texas should remain as part of Mexico.

The really big causes were the dreadful contempt and complete lack of attention from the part of the Mexican government to the northern provinces and territories. Basically nothing came from central Mexico. A survey carried out in the 1820's already warned the government of this, and the dangers of not instituting better policies to make Texians feel more like Mexicans. A feeble attempt at sending more colonists from central Mexico was carried out, but completely unsuccessful.

However, the detonator, of course, was when Santa Anna took power and changed the government system from a federal to centralist, and basically handled like a dictatorship. Texas was no the only Mexican province to rebel. Chihuahua, Zacatecas, and YucatÃ¡n did as well. Only YucatÃ¡n and Texas succeeded, the first mostly because of the distance from central Mexico; the latter because of the unofficial aid it got from the US (I mean, courage is all well and good, but can only go so far).

Sure, Mexican disorganization, lack of funds, lack of navy, and the savage and barbaric way to conduct war which both emboldened the Texians and demoralized the Mexicans (not happy at all with the situation) contributed a lot. And perhaps that's what we Mexicans don't really like about it. Not so much that we lost, but how and why we lost it. Something we need to learn to accept if we ever want to grow up as a people.

Re: Men of Legend: The Battle of the Alamo

Austin Porter — Wed, 08 Apr 2009 16:20:45 -0000

Rommel might very well have been a great general but but I don't respect him. Any more then I respect Stalin or Hitler because they were great leaders. I do feel that people who put there bodies where there mouths are, who place themselves in danger based on honorable intentions deserve our respect. We can argue about what honorable intentions are but supporting slavery is not one of them. As to Vietnam Vets: I have friends who volunteered and made certain they went to Vietnam to defeat Communism or liberate the south from northern aggression or what not . I think they were misguided in their reasons for enlisting, but it took a lot of nuts to make that choice. Some of them still think the war was worth fighting, others have changed their minds - all of them have my respect. The kids who went over feeling invincible, filled with piss and vinegar, wanting to kick some ass and prove how tough they were, they were young and foolish and if anything, I feel sorry for them. As for the people who thought that Oh,l maybe I wont get drafted, maybe I wont pass my physical, maybe I wont end up in the infantry, maybe I wont end up in Vietnam, maybe I wont see combat, I wondered how they could be so casual about their lives. But then we were kids, stupid, and if we made the right choices back then, we were probably lucky. I also wonder why, when we speak of bravery, we usually talk about war. The freedom riders in the early 60s, the blacks that sat in lunch counters and were beaten, they had a lot of balls to. Being a man, if you will, is more then muscle, it's having the courage to put your mind and muscle to work in support of what you think is an honorable cause. And, again, honorable people can disagree about what an honorable cause is.

Re: Men of Legend: The Battle of the Alamo

Mark — Tue, 07 Apr 2009 23:24:18 -0000

@ Jason Whitney:

Good work on being a marine, and excellent work on serving your country. That doesn't give you a leave pass on accuracy though. Nor does it give you the right to talk down to those of us who think differently to you.

Don't get hung up on my use of "snarl of defiance" - I was trying to illustrate a point that I think your judgement of Jim Bowie was unfair. Perhaps snarl of defiance is wrong, undoubtedly it's purple prose, but IMO it's a more accurate reflection of what happened based on the characters involved than what you portrayed.

Perhaps you aren't a dumb@ss, but be reasonable; when you come out calling people who do not share your point of view retards, racists (from your use of the phrase "they killed some Mexicans that get some of you off?") and that we should be ashamed of ourselves, then you're acting like a dumb@ss whether you really are one or not.

I'm not young. I wish I was, but I'm not.

Also, no matter how much older I get, since I live in Oz, and you presumably in the US, we'll never meet outside the "anonymity of the web". Since you could do nasty marine attack things to me in the flesh, I'm pretty sure that's a good thing. :-)

Re: Men of Legend: The Battle of the Alamo

Jason Whitney — Tue, 07 Apr 2009 21:59:20 -0000

@ Mark

I served in the Marines in both Iraq wars. I promise you, there is plenty of men out there worth honoring. Many of which are no longer with us.

But in all honesty, when someone such as yourself uses terms such as 'snarl of defiance', I can only laugh. Seriously? Grow up. I'm not a dumb@ss, as you so eloquently put it, I'm just a grown man. Come back when you've gone out young pup, lived a little, and grown some hair on your nuts. Then we can talk. Outside of the 'anonymity of the web'.

Re: Men of Legend: The Battle of the Alamo

Mark — Tue, 07 Apr 2009 20:46:50 -0000

@ Austin Porter:

LOL. Tell us, which historical figures *do* meet with your approval? Because when we judge history by today's standards there are precious few heroes/heroines left to admire. Are we allowed to admire the Spartans at Thermopylae; after all, they kept slaves. Are we allowed to admire Erwin Rommel; a brilliant general, but one working for the Nazis. What about Saburo Sakai of the Japanese air force in WWII? And how about Vietnam vets? Are we allowed to respect them? The list is endless. You would obviously disagree, but I think that for most of us it isn't a requirement that a person shares our viewpoints before we adjudge them worthy of our respect.

@ Jason Whitney:

Wow, man, it's almost like you were there with them when that old man selfishly killed all those young guys to validate his own existence. I wonder if that was his last thought, "Thank Goodness those men validated my existence before I died!" That sounds much more plausible than the snarl of defiance those of us who admire him think likely.

Please, next time you use the anonymity of the net to tell us all that we're racists and retards who should all be ashamed of ourselves, display less dumb@ssery when you do it.

Re: Men of Legend: The Battle of the Alamo

Jason Whitney — Tue, 07 Apr 2009 17:36:47 -0000

This is absolutely retarded. Old men whose lives have passed them and whose ego's are so big that they didn't have the balls to do what was that actual brave thing and surrender so that his men might live to fight another day.

Bowie and Crockett were in love with their over-inflated personas and they were willing to sacrifice the lives of many men in order to preserve them.

If you want a hero, look at the men who despite their youth and families, stood there ground on the wall and obeyed their orders, even if they came from an old man dieing on his death bed willing to use another mans life to validate his own. And here you all are, doing it for them. Or is it just the fact that they killed some Mexicans that get some of you off? You should all be ashamed.

Re: Men of Legend: The Battle of the Alamo

Austin Porter — Tue, 07 Apr 2009 12:18:52 -0000

The Alamo - certainly something to be proud of, a bunch of racists fighting to keep Texas a slave state.

Re: Men of Legend: The Battle of the Alamo

Mark — Tue, 07 Apr 2009 02:50:23 -0000

@ Jesse...

Well said, sir! It's always good to witness a solid, well-aimed verbal kick to the sack. :-D

I'm an Australian, and I admire the strong patriotism that I've seen in the Americans that I've personally known! I detest people who badmouth their own country to outsiders (posts like Jert and Cliff - sorry guys, it had to be said), and as for Cliff saying that the "men among men" who died at the Alamo are not deserving of his respect, well, I hazard a guess that if they were alive to care they wouldn't be losing too much sleep over that fact.

I've never even been to America, but these men (like all brave men) have my admiration and respect.

Re: Men of Legend: The Battle of the Alamo

Ethan — Tue, 07 Apr 2009 00:52:09 -0000

Well then - after reading ALL of the posts I see that my point in response to Britt has already been made, and made more eloquently! Apologies. Britt, I understand where you're coming from. The Globe and Cambridge can be pretty disgusting sometimes. But setting politics aside, I just don't want anyone not from the area overlooking the good things about Boston and the rest of New England for that matter. I encourage everyone to set your stereotypes about the region aside and pay a visit, if you haven't already. Especially if you're a history buff or an outdoorsman.

Re: Men of Legend: The Battle of the Alamo

Ethan — Tue, 07 Apr 2009 00:33:02 -0000

@Britt

I agree with you in regard to Jert's statement. But I invite you to come visit Boston. I grew up in New Hampshire (can I get a Live Free or Die?) and now live near, and work in, that bluest of blue cities. But the fact remains that it was and remains the cradle of democracy in our country. Any tour should include a visit to the John Adams historic site in Quincy, a walk on the Freedom Trail downtown (including Paul Revere's house, which still stands, the Old North Church, and the USS Constitution). And you can top it off with a brew from Sam Adams brewery in Jamaica Plain. Patriotic and manly activities all.

Ethan

Re: Men of Legend: The Battle of the Alamo

Jesse — Mon, 06 Apr 2009 22:39:02 -0000

... "Like many Texans, I have mixed feelings about the Alamo"... Wrong! Texans have no "mixed-feelings" about the Alamo. You little nancy-boy... Long live TEXAS!

"Brave men, perhaps. Worthy of my respect, I think not."... Why don't you jump up and bite my as$!!

YOU MAY ALL GO TO HELL - AND I WILL GO TO TEXAS!!

Re: Men of Legend: The Battle of the Alamo

Cliff — Mon, 06 Apr 2009 19:19:11 -0000

The Battle of the Alamo - They died defending slavery.

Brave men, perhaps. Worthy of my respect, I think not.

Re: Men of Legend: The Battle of the Alamo

Bill Hertzing — Mon, 06 Apr 2009 17:39:54 -0000

@Taylor Probably just an artist rendering of the upside-down flag for distress. The Texas Flag wasn't adopted until 1839.

Re: Men of Legend: The Battle of the Alamo

Tim Kiselis — Sun, 05 Apr 2009 02:42:50 -0000

My 5th great-uncle, Daniel William Cloud, Jr., fought and died at the Alamo. This is a passage from the last letter he wrote his family on his way to the Alamo. I just read your 35 great speeches and then saw this article on the Alamo and they reminded me of this letter.

"Ever since Texas has unfurled the banner of Freedom and commenced a

warfare for Liberty or Death, our hearts have been enlisted in her behalf. The

progress of her cause has increased the ardor of our feelings, until we have

resolved to embark in the vessel which contains the flag of Liberty and sink or

swim in its defence. Our Brethren of Texas were invited by the Mexican

Government while republican in its form to come and settle, they did so, they

have endured all the privations & sufferings incident to the settlement of a frontier

country and have surrounded themselves with all the comforts and

conveniences of live. Now the Mexicans with unblushing effrontery call on them

to submit to a Monarchical, tyrannical, Central despotism, at the bare mention of

which every true hearted son of Kentucky feels an instinctive horror followed by a

firm and steady glow of virtuous indignation. The cause of Philanthropy, of

humanity, of Liberty & human happiness throughout the world call loudly on every

man who can, to aid Texas. If you ask me how I reconcile the duties of a soldier

with those of a Christian I refer you to the memorable conversation between

Genl. Marion & DeKalb on this point, and the sentiments of the latter I have

adopted as my own. If we succeed, the country is ours, it is immense in extent

and fertile in its soil and will amply reward all our toils. If we fail death in the

cause of liberty and humanity is not cause for shuddering. Our rifles are by our

sides and choice guns they are; we know what awaits us and are prepared to

meet it."

Re: Men of Legend: The Battle of the Alamo

Taylor — Fri, 03 Apr 2009 23:02:42 -0000

And I know its memorize, I am a horrible typist

Re: Men of Legend: The Battle of the Alamo

Taylor — Fri, 03 Apr 2009 23:01:24 -0000

Just a random question-- why is the Texas flag in the picture upside down? The red always goes on bottom. An insignificant detail, but I couldn't help noticing.

As someone who has lived in Texas all of my life, its easy to forget the significance of the Alamo because we hear about it from the time we enter school. We should spend more time looking back at those stories we were forced to memerize in elementary school and recognizing that such stories tell us more than just who won or lost, or what events provided inspiration for later battles. These stories demonstrate that men throughout history have been willing to fight and die for their ideals, a commitment that seems sadly absent in today's me-first society.

Re: Men of Legend: The Battle of the Alamo

Brett McKay — Fri, 03 Apr 2009 22:04:00 -0000

@Aaron-That is one awesome flag. Thanks for sharing it.

And btw, I just read your blog and you're pretty dang funny.

Re: Men of Legend: The Battle of the Alamo

Aaron — Fri, 03 Apr 2009 21:57:03 -0000

Shortly before the battle of the Alamo, a group of Texans held of the Mexican army from taking one of their cannons. They raised perhaps the manliest flag ever:
https://www.galleryoftherep...

Re: Men of Legend: The Battle of the Alamo

Mike Habeeb — Fri, 03 Apr 2009 21:23:51 -0000

@ Britt ... again

I also have spent large amounts of time in Boston, and grew up just outside of it. From your latest post, it's tough to tell what side you're on. First you said Boston was anti American, and now you're saying that there's all sorts of patriots in the North End and Southie. I'm not here to argue JFK (or anyone's) politics because based on whether someone's a liberal or a conservative they're just going to say the other side is anti American.

Based on your last post, it seems that the only evidence you have for Boston being anti American (aside from your obvious distaste for liberal politics) is the Boston Globe and protesting students. So lets focus on those arguments.

Regarding the Globe: What I want to know is why the entire city of Boston gets called anti American just because the Globe published an opinion piece that attempted to discover how the situation became what it is in Afghanistan. There's nothing more American than the freedom of the press. Also, just as a point of clarification, the Globe never said that the terrorists were right, or that America deserved to be attacked, they simply published editorials that explained how the country of Afghanistan became such a power vacuum that terrorists were able to take power there.

Regarding protesting college students: Wherever there are college students, there will be protests. Most of them don't even care what they're protesting about. Each week they speak out against a new "injustice." It's part of being young. I would also like to point out that the colleges in Cambridge that you're referring to are not exactly full of native Bostonians, but rather are populated in large amounts by foreign students and out of state students. They aren't Bostonians any more than a kid from Chicago doing four years at Texas Tech is Texan.

As far as I can see, your entire argument, in reality, focuses on the politics being more liberal than you'd like and not on the actual feelings of Bostonians toward their country. I think you need to come up with a better argument, or stop attacking people.